Mike Wilson, LF/LB, and the Wells - A. Jones - Beltre template

Don't have too much else to do at the moment :- ) and am more interested in the Michael Wilson trial than I'd be with a lot of other things, such as continued Ryan Langerhans at-bats, Carlos Peguero experiments, or waiting to see if our DH can get a ball out to the warning track on this road trip.

So, here y'go amig-O's.  The Linebacker Template.

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=== State of the Chatter ===

For those who just joined us, here's a 10-second lead-in on what people think about Wilson getting a chance in the majors:

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  • AGIN':  Can't hit good velocity.
  • FO':  If true ... also true of some ML players.  And they have velocity in AAA.  ... blasted RHP's last year, indicating that his reflexes are fine.

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  • AGIN':  Can't play defense.
  • FO':  Sounds like "kludgy" getting warped into "hurtful to the team."  Wilson runs real fast, and Zduriencik said he's the backup CF.

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  • AGIN':  Has been in the minors 10 years.  No prospect.
  • FO':  He has a great excuse for slow development:  like Conine, he's not a natural baseball player.  Late bloomers, Geronimo Berroa's and Raul Ibanez'es, and Ryan Howards, exist.

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  • AGIN':  "Needing a RH outfielder" is a weak excuse.
  • FO':  What M's need is a Replacement Level outfielder, Wilson being their only internal chance at this.

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SSI sees Michael Wilson as having a 40%, 50% chance to quickly perform at RL or better, and having some chance (maybe 10%) to surprise and become an ML regular.  So it's worth the chance.

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=== Batspeed ===

As SSI casts its key characteristics for Wilson, we look for a couple of things...

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Kudos to ECoug who was first to relay the scouts' general consensus on Wilson:  "Can't hit velocity and is a DH."  ... on the other side of that one have been Jack Zduriencik, Don Wakamatsu, Mike Curto (very politely), and (lol) me.

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Kudos to Jeff Sullivan who got to Mike Curto on this one. Curto is a national treasure ... okay, a regional treasure.  SSI was pleased to see that, in this case, Curto assessed Wilson the same way that we did.  There's one guy that it's nice to agree with.  ;- )

If LL can get us Curto's takes on promoted Rainiers, that'll be soooo sweet.

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Kudos to Prospect Insider who relayed some more scouting opinion on Wilson.  Whether Dr. D agrees with this or that ... of course it's cool to hear the consensus.

There was one particular snippet that Jason relayed --- > which synch'ed up 100.00% with my own observations of Wilson.  This specific observation rings true:

His bat speed is average, but he's tremendously strong, producing well above-average raw power. He likes to extend his arms and has power to left-center, all the way round to right-center.

Bat speed is average but has raw power.  That's a great way to capture Mike Wilson, provided that you keep in mind Bruce Lee's three possible definitions of bat (hand) speed:

  • Perceptual speed - Ability to gain advance notice on what's happening
  • Reflexive speed - Ability to get your hand from A to B, once you decide to do so
  • Throughspeed - MPH of your hand (bat) once accelerated

Here is where SSI judges these three things on Wilson:

  • Perceptual - better than most minor leaguers' (is 27 y.o. and reads curves nicely)
  • Reflexive - Mediocre (just too bulky to be mongoose-quick)
  • Throughspeed - Superb (distance of HR balls reflects speed of bat in zone)

I think that if you're trying to get ahold of Wilson, there you go.  He is certainly not "quick" at the plate, in the sense that Dustin Ackley is quick.

But his bat is a blur once he launches, which can create confusion about what his batspeed is.

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=== Templates ===

There are quite a few RH football-player types in the big leagues... many of them synch up to this scout's review of Wilson:

He has problems with good velocity, and can't handle fastballs in on him. He likes to extend his arm and has power to left-center, all the way round to right-center.

At times Wilson sits breaking ball and can generally do a good job hitting them hard, but he will chase balls out of the zone, especially down and away.

In a fastball count, he will hit the daylights out of an average heater and hit it a long way, but he's still one to swing and miss and doesn't hit the ball to right field enough to hit for average.

Tell me what part of this would not apply to Good Adrian Beltre?  Beltre is another muscle-bound slugger with mediocre bat launch but excellent raw power.

The "get him on the hands or with sliders low-away" is an FKey7 approach.  Jim Lefebvre preached constantly that Jay Buhner (another muscle-bound RHB) would never be able to deal with this simple pitch sequence.

So you can see specifically why SSI does not believe that "pound his hands and then go off the plate away" is much of an indictment of Wilson personally.  It's like saying, "Show Ian Kinsler a real sharp Erik Bedard curve and then come back with good velocity at the letters."  Well, yeah.

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Here are some muscle-bound RH hitters who do have (1) mediocre bat launch, (2) great throughspeed, and (3) questionable run values on fastballs:

The Great Mike Curto :- ) said, on LL, that Wilson (1) does hit offspeed better than FB ... and that (2) he usually looks bad (e.g. on fastballs) when overswinging.

Go through the list of Joneses, Wellses, etc. and BINGO!  you will see that this group loves to blast curve balls, and that the group has to work to stay even +0.00 on fastballs.

Carlos Lee is an exception, because he's better than the other guys.  But they all hurt offspeed pitches and they're all okay with fastballs.

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Vernon Wells is an unlikely, but very cool, template for Michael Wilson.  

  • Loves to crush CB and CU
  • Battles to stay even with heaters
  • Used to be fast enough to play CF, now is somewhat dubious in LF
  • 0.50 EYE
  • 270/330/475 slash line is what Wilson would do if he panned out

Wells has been very inconsistent as a hitter, see-saw'ing between 130 OPS+'s and 80's.  

I suspect that this would be true of the Beltre / A. Jones / V. Wells family in general:  years skewing more wildly to UP/DWN than most other hitters.

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=== Rohrshach Test ===

Have you ever realized that there is such a player - a football type with average bat launch, excellent power, who looks mechanical, but who winds up with plenty of RBI's?

A guy who often pulls rocks out in the field, but who outruns a lot of his mistakes?

What has been your instinctive reaction to these kludgy-looking, but often effective, players?  :- )  It might tell you something about the way you view baseball.

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=== Dr's Prognosis ===

First of all, gentlemen, the definition of "prospect":  if a player's ceiling is ML fringe, then he is by definition a "prospect."

Kyle Seager is headed for ML fringe.  That makes him a prospect, as opposed to some guy struggling in A+ who will never even get to AAA.  That is a non-prospect.

Even if you think Michael Wilson's ceiling is 4th outfielder, then of course he is a "prospect."  The minors are there to feed the majors.

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Based on other players in his general category, I don't believe that Michael Wilson's mediocre bat launch is a fatal flaw.

Here's my wild guess for Wilson:

  • 10-20% - A few years as a Vernon Wells or Adam Jones type
  • 30% - A few years as a fringe ML player who helps at times (perhaps Michael Morse or Ryan Langerhans contribution)
  • 50-60% - Won't have a career at all

This would make a Michael Wilson trial extremely preferable to losing another 70 games by 2-1 scores.

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That's my opinion I could be wrong,

Dr D





Comments

1

:Riding in the car.  She likes to drive:
So, hon, you remember that Saturday game we went to, with Fister pitching?
"Hm."
The one where all the balls fell in between the fielders?
::angry, jaw set:: "Half was balls falling in, and half was that BRAD!! ley."::  >:-[
They fixed that.  Think you can guess how?
:instantly: "They switched Fister and Bradley!"
:long pause:  :cracks up at herself:
.........
Um, .... they cut Bradley and they brought up John's favorite player, that linebacker.
"YESSSSS!"  >:-]  :slaps windshield, car veers just shy of ditch on right:
"Can we sit in the Mezzanine tomorrow night?"
I guess, if we can catch a flight to Baltimore.
"Oh.  Well, what time's the game on TV."
.........
She found this drive romantic.  Bet you wish you had a girlfriend like that, huh.

2

Wow!
Three words, Doc!
Marry that gal!  :)
I like the established odds you've set, too.
If 10 guys with M. Wilson's skill set came up at the same time, 3 would contribute for a while, 2 wuld burn bright for a while, and 5 would fizzle out right away.
But I wonder if Mikey's circuitious route to the BL's hasn't honed his focus to up those odds a bit.  And I suspect wilson's ablity is understated because he has taken that circuitious path, i.e., "if he was any good he would have been up at the age of 24!"
But, as you've mentioned previously, he was very nearly up by that age.....it was a close thing.
He can play.  He's athletic (He was going to be a D-1 linebacker, for goodness sake). He'll help.  Starting tonight.
I'm not working out tonight...so I can be here to watch!
 
moe

3
ghost's picture

You have no idea how lucky you are...or perhaps you do. :)
Then again, my gf is a Red Sox fan who nonetheless considers it romantic to watch Mariners games and listen to me call them like a play by play announcer. LOL I doubt I could date someone who didn't care for baseball.

4

Heading to the NW in June for a few days of vacation in Oregon with my girlfriend around family visits and a cabin on the shore, but she made a point to plan our vacation weekend around an Ms homestand so we could get up to Seattle and catch a game.
Gotta love a girl who will encourage your baseball vice. ;)
And yeah, give Wilson a shot.  Maybe he's the slow-learning version of Wily Mo Pena or one of the other guys on your list.  There's nothing wrong with minimum wage contributions from a guy like Wilson - he'll be over the hill when his service time expires, so you get whatever good years he might have to offer on the cheap.
And if he doesn't offer any, you didn't lose anything other than Bradley's bad attitude.
Here's hoping he hits the optimistic 50%.  When he catches hold of a pitch that'll at least be exciting too, no matter what.
~G

5
glmuskie's picture

If MW can really hit bendy stuff, he should do OK, I'd think.  Opposing pitchers are probably going to give him the standard rookie diet of offspeed pitches - that's kind of the default approach unless the pitcher has a truly electric fastball.
A couple early jacks on hanging sliders and then maybe he starts to get some respect.  Then he can protect Cust in the lineup.  ; )

6

I did - 30 years ago. ;-)
Your odds-lines and mine on Wilson may be a skosh disrespectful to the House but hey. Maybe that's all the oh-fer 20's talking .....
Mega cpoints for being a real fan amigo... 
A Stars & Scrubs rebuild with fresh blood coming in monthly, now that's the way to get baseball rollin' in a dead town...

7

Curse you, red baron.
Funny thing. Usually when the M's wind up doing something that we pitched a little on SSI, like Wright to setup or Doogie to the rotation or Saunders to CF, I wind up visualizing the train wreck (and often getting it). With Wilson am visualizing a nice first week.

8

Funny to see a Rainier come up with such a layered approach to hitting, right out of the box.
That's probably what has me getting too bullish :)

9
ghost's picture

...I don't iknow if I'd say what I said topped your little anecdote...it's close. On the one hand, my gf thinks my passion for this game is one of my greatest character strengths...which is a rare thing to find. :) And I'm a huge dork, so my passion is expressed in weird ways...LOL On the other hand...Cindy knows a heck of a lot more about baseball than my gf does. I would characterize her as a casual Red Sox fan by familial association...not a die hard...she understands the basic rules and statistics, but thinks it's funny how in depth my commentary on a game tends to get. Not sure which is better...it's call it a happy draw. :)

10
RockiesJeff's picture

I knew you were a smart man and good judge of character!

11

Not a big fan of his but he was just released today and I would much rather see him in centerfield and give us some quality at bats than have Saunders out there.  The M's are throwing away some great pitching and at some point real soon it's going to have a real consequence on the pitchers psychy.  I know Podsednik isn't a great outfielder but to be able to give a major league at bat is a big deal at this point.  Plus he had 35 steals last year.  Bat him last then you'll have strait speedsters in a row and hope they get on before Smoake comes to bat.  Saunders should not be an everyday outfielder right now.  End of Story.

12

As a Langerhans-type tweener, playing LF and backing up in CF, the argument-for would start with the fact that at ages 33 and 34, he was a league-average LH batter...
Am biased against Podsednik but much to my surprise, his EYE, his PX and his SPD weren't notably off at age 34, and you're talking about a 4.5 runs-per-27 guy...
So if we are going to clatter our spoons for RLP's and 4 runs a game, we've got to admit that Scott Podsednik's hat would be in the ring for 2011 band-aid solutions...
Not sure I'd be thinking 35-year-old band-aids for this club, but hey, we brought up "RLP" and you brought up Podsednik... fair nuff Merks.
............
Last few games, Saunders has shown a little flash, including 1st-to-3rds and long HR's and the like... if only that guy could get it together .... but, the proverbial "holes in his swing" seem to actually hold true in this case.  In, out, and down, he just can't get to the ball.

13

The Rainiers played against Podsednik's team last week.  Then, last night, while Adam Jones and Chris Tillman were ganging up on the Ms, Tacoma was shut down for six innings by a gentleman pitching for the Oklahoma City RedHawks by the name of Ryan Rowland-Smith:
6.0 IP, 6 H, 1 ER, 1 BB, 7 K
Whatever happened to Wladimir Ballentien?  Bucky Jacobsen?  Clint Nageotte?
Wlad is with the Yakult Swallows of the NPB
Looks like Bucky last played in the Mexican League in 2007.
Nageotte was still pitching in the independent Golden League in 2010!  Not very well, though:  http://www.baseball-reference.com/minors/player.cgi?id=nageot001cli
Not gonna get started on Shin-Soo (career 134 OPS+) Choo . . . 

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