POTD Trevor Bauer - K/BB ratio personified

If you haven't read this article linked by Taro, check it out.

Taro starting to sway us ... at the #3 pick :- )  ... no, just kidding.

.

=== SAT's Dept. ===

In the 1970's and 1980's, James used to make this one of his top 5, 6 criteria for a young pitching prospect.  He thought high IQ, or at least high baseball IQ, was an important factor in projecting success.

Take two pitchers with exactly the same stuff, one with a 100 IQ and another with a 140 IQ, and there are countless advantages that the smart guy (Jamie Moyer, Erik Bedard, Greg Maddux, etc) has.  

There is pitchability - just the ability to out-think hitters and deploy effective pitch sequences.

There is learning curve - the ability to "take" hard-knocks lessons and adjust to them before the arm burns out.

There is the tendency for higher-IQ people to enjoy precision over power.

From a failsafe standpoint, a smart guy hurts his arm, he comes up with alternative approaches quicker.

.

etc. etc. .... anyway, agree or don't, James (and I) believe that intelligence is a big advantage on offense.  For the same reasons that you don't want a dumb guy playing quarterback, or point guard.

.

Offense?  Yeah.  Quarterbacking a football team, playing point guard on a basketball team, pitching on a baseball team -- those guys hold the ball and attack.  In baseball the pitcher attacks the catcher's mitt and the strike zone.

Defense -- cornerback on a football team, perimeter defender in the NBA, or Ichiro swatting "passes" away from the strike zone -- defense values reaction and physical talent over brains.

In baseball, the pitcher is on offense and the hitter reacts/defends.  He's like a cornerback breaking up a pass.

.

The offense has time to think.  A quarterback has spent days thinking about what he's going to do during the next four seconds.  A pitcher also has twenty or thirty seconds to think about, and visualize, what he's going to do during the next four seconds.

A quarterback, and a pitcher, can deploy and utilize his intelligence.

.

=== K/BB Personified ===

Maybe this guy is the ultimate Oakland A's pitching draftee -- K/BB ratio personified.

By this we don't mean, "A guy who has a very high strikeouts/walk number."  We're talking about the reasons a team wants a pitcher who runs a high K/BB.

.

K rate itself, reflects stuff.  A guy with higher velocity, and more bite on his curve, has more strikeouts.*

You see 9 strikeouts per 9 innings, you know that hitters have a hard time seeing the ball.

.

But K/BB ratio reflects how well a guy pitches given the stuff that he has.  

Doug Fister, with a 5.0/1.5 ratio, deploys his stuff better than some guy with a 5.0/3.0 ratio.  Jered Weaver deploys his stuff better than does (the burned-out) Daisuke Matsuaka.  Two guys with the same K rate and same stuff -- whether it's 5k with 89 mph, or 8k with 94 mph -- it's the guy with the good K/BB ratio who is using his stuff better.

.

Guys with good K/BB ratio have better mechanics, as a group.  They are pitchers rather than throwers, and therefore better bets to stay healthy.

Trevor Bauer, if we are to believe his insane K/BB outcomes and his interviews, is the state-of-the-art on K/BB ratio.

.

=== Stuff ===

It ain't like this guy is Brad Radke, either.  He's a foot or two short of Tim Linecum in college -- and Tim Lincecum is now four feet short of Tim Lincecum in college.

He's got my fave second pitch for a power RHP, that being the straight change.  Think Freddy and Pedro.

All the scouts say his slider is ML plus right now, and he's got a 12-6 change curve ... He supposedly has a Cuban / Luis Tiant ability to come up with even more creative stuff.

He's got 140 strikeouts in 90 innings at UCLA; Lincecum had 200 in 125 innings at the UW, so the K rate is exactly the same and Bauer has a lot fewer walks.

You might even be inclined to think:  K advantage = Bauer, since Lincecum could afford to simply step halfway to home plate and power the ball by the hitters.

.

It's a major point that Bauer doesn't throw as hard, or deceptively, as Lincecum did.  But Lincecum didn't need to throw 98, as it turns out.  Bauer piles up counter-advantages higher and higher until they brush the ceiling.

Lincecum's impossibly long fastball made his stardom a no-brainer.  

Does Bauer have a "calling card" weapon that practically guarantees his success?  I believe he does:  it's the Felix arsenal, the 94 mph fastball amplified by three different reliable strikeout pitches to go with it.

It ain't like Bauer's fastball is middling, either.  He's 92-96, he shortens the path like Lincecum, and Bauer solemnly swears he'll throw 97-100.

.

SSI would not sell Bauer as the 10-Year-1/1 that Lincecum was.  But almost, man.

.

=== Mechanics ===

Very similar to Lincecum's, obviously, which see.

Though Bauer has the locked front knee that I don't like, in his case that's a quibble.

The broad point is that his CG travels wayyyyyyy forward, as smoothly as if he were an ice skater with Vaseline on his skates, and his arm clears with about four miles to spare on any side.

The sheer oil-slick smoothness with which Bauer's CG travels forward, funnelling its energy into an arm that also decels as if gliding on ice, is pure poetry.

Tim Lincecum kept his front knee flexed so that his CG was feather-light into the finish.  Bauer's CG travels forward more heavily, but it's the difference between a wisp of smoke coming at you, vs. a light train on rails that it isn't even making contact with.

.

=== Top 3 Emerges ===

Bauer isn't a flavor of the month for us.  There are various reasons that SSI -- not being well-informed -- wouldn't consider other pheenoms with the #2 overall:

  • D. Hultzen, LHP - 90 mph fastball makes stardom a longshot
  • B. Starling OF, F. Lindor SS - unless they're ARod, you don't take HS players over Rendon
  • D. Bundy RHP - 100 mph fastball but 3+ years to bigs (injury & David Clyde risk)
  • S. Gray RHP - max effort rep, M's would switch him to closing
  • etc

Neither should Gerrit Cole be dropped out of the top 3.  

It was an overreaction to make him the clear 1 earlier, and it's an overreaction to drop him out of the top 3 now.  Big fastball with celebrated straight change, big guy, dazzling results have been there for a while now ... he's pretty clearly ahead of the pack.

Looks like a clear top 3 emerging.  The M's will have a franchise commodity for sure.

Taro called this Bauer guy a long time ago.  When was your first mention of him as a possible M at #2 there, champ?

.

Five years ago, nobody would have had the guts to draft him.  But now every other story calls him Tim Lincecum v2.0.  Since Lincecum, scouts and directors are no longer risking their jobs by backing Trevor Bauer.  They have a bumper-sticker legal defense.

.

=== Career Arc ===

John Olerud never spent a single day in the minors, and did not need to.

It's interesting to think about this particular kid going straight to the majors.  Would it be much different from a (super-intelligent) NPB pitcher going to the majors?

What do coaches know about baseball that Trevor Bauer does not know?  Well, they know Paul Konerko's hot and cold zones, which they can give to Bauer on a thumb drive.

He's a platypus.  He's the kid who holed up in his room and hacked PlayStation.  You don't sit him down in your class and talk at him, just because you're ten years older than he is.

.

I'd be intrigued by the idea of Bauer helping the Mariners this year.  Intrigued by, LrkrBoi29.

.

=== Best Bet ===

Was never near as much a Cole fan as the scouts were, when they were selling him as better than Rendon.  So Cole has a big fastball?  Yeah, him and Sidney Ponson and a lot of guys.

.

First look at Trevor Bauer, though, this dude is myyyyyy kinda pitcher.  Maybe, as Michael Pineda is the salve that healed the Randy Johnson wound, Bauer would be the mindwipe that finally exorcised the Tim Lincecum demons around here.

Pittsburgh takes Rendon, I'll probably be hoping for Bauer over Cole.  But either one gives a real nice shot at a drive-through fast food TOR starter.

M's wind up with Trevor Bauer rather than Rendon, I won't shed tear one.  

.

Nice job Taro,

Dr D

.


Comments

1

But that's like saying "I like 50-caliber machine guns better than bazookas when destroying the enemy position."
I think Bauer is quicker to the bigs than almost anyone, is a thinking pitcher, and should have several years of phenomenal performance.
Bauer will also get out of whack with his delivery at some point, IMO, and is gonna have to climb back on his horse - but he throws a dozen or whatever pitches and is always tinkering.  He knows how to do that.
I've never been as high on Cole as some other people, but I still think he's a legit #2, and for us he only needs to be a #3.
Bauer's college workload is scaring scouts, since he just throws inning after inning and has high (for college) pitch counts.
I remember that being a problem with Lincecum too.
Bauer's for real, in my estimation.  I would not complain at all if we drafted him with Rendon gone.  I would complain some if we drafted him with Rendon there...but he has a chance to be really special.
So does Cole.  But I like Bauer to be special NOW, and now is an important time-frame for a team trying to get a championship out of Felix Hernandez.
Cole is built like a front-line pitcher.  Bauer is built like a 7th inning specialist.  To scouts, that still means a lot.
But as you say, maybe passing on Lincecum for frame concerns made an impression on the Mariners and they'd do it differently if given the same choice again.
Whomever Zduriencik takes I'll have some faith in, simply because he's never really missed in the first round.  The one year he did, he backed it up with a second rounder that produced like a first-rounder in the bigs.
But my wishlist would go Rendon, then Bauer, then Cole.  If Jack's is different, then I trust him.
But I'd be curious to see if it is.
~G

2
Lonnie of MC's picture

Bauer got my attention back in early March and I started asking around about him.  The knocks then was the same as they are now.  One thing that I haven't heard much about of late though is that there may be an issue with coachability.  Bauer seems to want to maintain what he has, and if that works for him then, great.  The organization that drafts Bauer will have to let him be himself to a very large extent, but I don't know if the Mariners are one of those types of organizations.  It sure seems to me that they love to tinker with their players to try to maximize what is already there.
Recently I got word that they have been tinkering with Nate Tenbrinks swing, and the results so far is an unhappy player and disasterous results at the plate...
In my mind, each of the three (Rendon, Cole, and Bauer) has issues that have to be kept in mind after the Pirate's pick.  Rendon has injury concerns that to me loom large, Cole has been having consistancy issues, and Bauer may or may not be the next "Freak".
Things are definately getting interesting.
Lonnie

3
Taro's picture

Completely agree Doc. Short of Lincecum in college, but there aren't any Harpers, Strasburgs, or Lincecums in this draft. Bauer throws about as hard as Lincecum does now.
I also don't like the locked knee, but he has an excellent delivery overall. Bauer's mechanics and the fact that he never gets his arm sore are a big point in his favor.
Really think Bauer is an even safer prospect than Rendon. Hitting prospects are worth twice as much as pitching prospects because of injury, but durable SPs are pretty rare. The high IQ, the willingness to adjust,  raw stuff, and durability make him the most likely prospect of the three to hit his ceiling IMO.
I'd be happy with either Rendon or Bauer. Cole would make the draft dissapointing for me. Hes practically the same as drafting a high-risk/high-upside highschool SP. 
 
 

4

Just a month or two ago, scouts were questioning Bauer for the first round at all.  BP's mid-March article said "the day Cole turns pro is the day he becomes the best pitching prospect in baseball" while scoffing at Bauer's "exaggerated" motion and 50-50-55-50 pitches...
Bauer destroying Cole in the same conference and even from the same pitching staff might have had a little to do with it.... we definitely have a Lincecum vs Morrow stats-comp situation here...

5

One of your alltime calls.  :- )
Guess here is that if the M's did get Cole, everybody would warm back up to him soon enough.  LOL.  Not sure what the little hiccup is, but IMHO that guy's the real deal, as college SP's go.
But yeah.  Now you're saying that if the Pirates take Angie Mentchink (sp) your selection is Bauer?

6
Taro's picture

I'd probably still take Rendon, but Bauer is the only player in this draft so far without injury or performance risks. Both Rendon and Cole are injury and performance risks.
Should Cole be a lock in the top 2 with a middling college performance? Great stuff, but if he can't leverage it into results and/or can't stay healthy it won't mean much. Supposedly Cole doesn't have much seperation in velocity between his fastball/slider/change and subpar fastball command which may be the reason hes getting knocked around a bit.

7
FNietzche's picture

First thing that popped out at me when reading his player page- Engineering Major.  As an engineering major myself I have to say that this factor alone gaves him an A+ for makeup in my book.
Graduating with a degree in engineering means he is either, A) A tireless worker or B) so intelligent he doesn't need to work as hard.
90% of these students have to put in 50-60 hours per week just to pass, 65+ to do well.  The best students in my classes are putting in 60+ hours per week, and even the most gifted ones do at least 40.  His work ethic must be superhuman to both study and engineering and star in the PAC 10 simultaneously, few of my fellow students would be capable. All this at a world-renowned university, no less.
He's either wicked smart or a incredibly vigorous worker, probably both. Although being either one alone bodes very, very well for his chances of being an impact player in the bigs.  One thing that you can count on is that he won't be a problem off the field.

8

I couldn't figure out why he wasn't getting top-half-of-the-first pub after last year.  I thought I must be missing something, so I made it a point to watch him this year.
I still don't get it - he's fabulous.  When taro and I first started talking about him I think both of us expected the other to scoff at the idea of considering him with our pick.  That didn't happen. ;)
I just keep watching the body of work he's building up, the stuff that he has, the regimen that he uses...
I like it.  I really like the whole package.  As Lonnie notes, the team that drafts him needs to let HIM mess with his mechanics and stuff instead of letting some "pitching coach" rubber stamp him in their mold and mess him up.
He's unique.  Treat him like he's unique and he should be just fine.
Again, I get the love for Cole - one minor tweak in changeup velocity or whatever and he could destroy major leaguers forever.  He's got that Roger Clemens/Felix Hernandez "I can throw this stuff all day" body and approach, and he throws like he means to hurt somebody.
Bauer's a consummate competitor who walks to the beat of his own drum, does him own noodling with new pitches and approaches every offseason, and is competing against himself to be the best player he can be.
Cole's a boxer, looking to beat up and knock down everyone in his way.  This year he's throwing punches and whiffing more often, but he'll connect again soon enough.
Bauer's a golfer, looking for his version of perfection in an imperfect game.  It's an endless quest that only the best ever really undertake, because for everyone else beating their opponent is enough.  Besting themselves isn't what they're paid to do.
If we were drafting 7th I'd be screaming all draft day for Bauer to get to us.  I don't think we'll take him at #2 even if scouts and "experts" are finally coming around on him being a top-10 pitcher...as long as it's the end of the 10.
I'd take him.  As my man Satchel Paige said, "Just throw strikes.  Home plate don't move."  Bauer throws strike after strike after strike, with made up pitches and variations on those pitches and pure heat and everything in between.
Paige used to make up pitches, too.  I can't help it, I love me a thinking pitcher who is the master of his own destiny and takes it in both hands.
Maybe I'm wrong, and Bauer's repertoire of 50-rated pitches (ha) won't cut it in the bigs.
Somebody's gonna find out, and I wouldn't mind if it's us.
~G

9

Holy Snot!  He's struck out 145 guys in 92 (or there-abouts) innings this year....and given up about 45 hits.  He's currently striking out 3 stimes as many guys as gets hits off of him.
In '72 Ryan sniffed at a 2 to 1 ration, ditto '87 (but not as close as '72)
 
Randy Johnson sniffed at it in '95 and was better than 2-1 in 2001.
Pro vs. college, I know.....but 31 is astounding.
 
By the way, I thought Bauer's motion and mechanics looked just fine.  I don't see a locked plant leg, at all.
 

10
Taro's picture

Ya, I'm with you there. Who knows if Cole can develop a slower change and slider without being deliberate. Most pitchers never do develop a good change. Cole is getting plus-plus reports on the change solely due to the movement, but its not a weapon if low A hitters can adjust to it looking fastball.
You're projecting at that point. I don't want to project at #2 unless I've got a monster position player prospect.
Cole's upside is higher than Bauer, but how much higher really either than 2mph on the heater? Cole's downside is FAR higher. Bauer is a much better pitcher right now with a far better chance of staying healthy. 
If ceiling is the sole consideration, why not draft Bundy or Bubba?

11

If you haven't read Jay's review of the candidates for the #2 overall, man.  You're missing out.You go down the list on those detail factoids and they are just nails every time, e.g.Before, we might have easily said that he’d be the fastest pitcher to get to the big leagues from this draft, and maybe the fastest player overall, but that loss of command is a little concerning and it’s hard to figure out what the root cause of it is.As it happens, SSI has figured out the root cause ;- ) but that's another subject.Jay's review of every single prospect is a pleasure to read.

Add comment

Filtered HTML

  • Web page addresses and e-mail addresses turn into links automatically.
  • Allowed HTML tags: <a> <em> <strong> <cite> <blockquote> <code> <ul> <ol> <li> <dl> <dt> <dd><p><br>
  • Lines and paragraphs break automatically.

Plain text

  • No HTML tags allowed.
  • Web page addresses and e-mail addresses turn into links automatically.
  • Lines and paragraphs break automatically.

shout_filter

  • Allowed HTML tags: <a> <em> <strong> <cite> <blockquote> <code> <ul> <ol> <li> <dl> <dt> <dd>
  • Lines and paragraphs break automatically.
  • Web page addresses and e-mail addresses turn into links automatically.