Pause at the Top
How I learned to slow down and hit .367, Dept.

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For all you brand-new readers ... welcome and two things you should know.

1.  If you join the conversation, we'll be delighted.  And we don't bite.  :- )  You don't have to be as expert (in any topic) as Rick in order to chat with us.  Also, you don't have to be as expert as my daughter.  If you ask "why do they go to the base when they get four balls?" that will actually lead to a fascinating conversation.

So, 'ave at us mate.

2.  MoeDawg (Keith) brings the vaunted SSI "cross-training" element when he's talking about hitting, is 'cause he is a scratch golfer, and few things in sports are as similar as the baseball swing and the golf swing.

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DAWG SEZ

Cultural Patience:   I've been watching some highlights of Matsui +Son, Kim and some other Korean stars.  What stands out is how they wait, weight back, with the bat (letting the ball travel) then they don't seem to try to hit it out, just hit it hard.

I am intrigued.  Like the Kuma's who appear to "pause" or "pose" in their motion, Asian hitters (or real good ones) give the perception of having more of this than their American (North/Central/South) counterparts.

Of course, I'm looking at a bunch of BMOC's in their respective leagues and none of those Smoaks.

I'm sure you've written about his in Aiki terms with pitchers, but can not recall if you've done it with batters.

Mr. Oh, of course, was the poster chld for this, with his Ott-like perch.  But it seems to be "cultural" in some sense.  There is no hurry, or less of it, to my eye, than you see in your typical MLB'er.  A "go slow to go fast" approach.

"Wait, wait, wait, attack"

Fill us in.  I'm really into that approach, right now.

Both Son and Kim have so many AB's where they rip it the other way, often launched down the LF line, yet they are not "going the other way" (intentionally).

I want guys like this.

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WEIGHT AND WAIT

Wade Boggs' mantra.  

If you really are Dr. D's daughter reading this, Wade Boggs was a famous Red Sox hitter in the 1980s who routinely batted .360+ in his prime.  He did it by swinging very, very late, "picking the ball out of the catcher's mitt."  This gave him more time to see the pitch; it was like he turned the volume down on a 92 MPH fastball until it was 88 MPH.  In baseball, guys with 92 MPH fastballs might receive $75,000,000 contracts and guys with 88 MPH fastballs might receive a blog where they can write about guys with 92 MPH fastballs.

Boggs meant, "Keep your weight back as the ball is approaching and wait an extra tick to hit it."  He stepped into the box and muttered to himself, Weight and Wait.  Now, those are swing keys you can actually apply in 0.4 seconds.

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Moe Dawg has absolutely a great observation about star Asian hitters.  We've seen the "pause at the top" with Iwakuma et al on the mound.  And I agree that you could perceive this with Ichiro, Godzilla, et al, as though there is a (more) distinct moment in which they're making sure to perceive the pitch before acting.

Keith I would *love* to see an explanation, pro and con, of a (reasonably) exaggerated "pause at the top" concept in golf.  Have seen a few weekend warriors on the course who paused for like 2 seconds :- ) at the top of their drives.

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LIFE LESSON

An astronaut once said, "if I had 10 seconds to live, I would use 9 of them to think and 1 of them to ACT."

but .. how EASY is it to do that in the middle of a "spirited debate" with your wife

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MARINERS APPLICATIONS 

1)  Don't be afraid to enjoy this Iwakuma pause more thoroughly.

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2)  Don't be afraid to "buy in" to Asian hitting stars an extra thumb's worth on the scale.  Especially with the Royals' approach all the rage among real GM's.  Kim and Son are going to get nice contracts and spots in MLB lineups.

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3 a b c)  Robinson Cano gains this advantage by INVERTING it with his "fence drill."  He defends the jam pitch so beautifully, it "frees" him to wait on the ball.  Does that make sense?

Nelson Cruz is known as a cleanup hitter who is --- > well capable of hitting the ball hard to right field.  And one of the 3 cleanup hitters who can pull the ball in the air when he chooses to.

Kyle Seager gets many of his "hard RBI" by relaxing and zinging a little shot to LF.  Yes, it's trite to single :- ) out these three stars as being good at Wait and Weight, but it is TRUE.

3d) Mark Trumbo, when he is in sync, is actually quite talented at this.  And, Trumbo is quite talented at hitting the ball 450 feet.  There's a reason the guy is a starter.

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Taylor
He's got 230 AB's to date, not 1,230

4) Outside of the stars, Chris Taylor is by far the best Mariner at this.  When I say "By Far" I mean, there is a huge gap between him and number 2, that being Jesus Montero with Trumbo probably being # three.  Dr. D believes in Taylor; like Bill James says, you have to give a young player some time.

Now, how about that discussion of "Wait and Weight" in golf?

Enjoy,

Jeff

Blog: 

Comments

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RockiesJeff's picture

Wait and Weight? Good thoughts Doc! I was waiting for Moe to reply but let me get th ball rolling. And please….pick this apart and set me straight but off the top of my head, which is always a danger….golf and baseball are obviously very similar – both hitting and pitching, even throwing. Back to physics….yep, pull out that Golfing Machine copy you have there in the closet. There are also serious differences with hitting. In baseball the ball is moving so you must figure out spin to get the speed. Also, the ball comes at a different rate so you don’t initiate the swing as in golf when you want….Golf you swing when you are ready unless, of course, the yips settle in. So there are differences in timing due to those realities. Because the ball in golf is hopefully not moving, does that mean a delay or to freeze at the top of a golf swing might be helpful. Maybe some can excel at that but goofy unique quirks of a mega-talented person can’t always be duplicated. The key to me is to slow down enough to make sure that energy is not lost in a fast backswing, balance is always maintained and then everything is ready to let the club headed into the ball with in a consistent repeatable maximum way. For most, they will find it easier to hit it more solid and further without a definite pause but simply a slower backswing that is not herky jerky quick at the top. Slow there with proper lag to build power is how guys like Moe swing easy and hit is hard!

 

 

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++The key to me is to slow down enough to make sure that energy is not lost in a fast backswing, balance is always maintained and then everything is ready to let the club headed into the ball with in a consistent repeatable maximum way. - See more at: http://seattlesportsinsider.com/comment/110152#comment-110152++

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If you're golfing these days Jeff, you've always got a podium for teaching.  :: taps mike, hands left ::

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Moe never answered the exaggerated pause at the top for young golfers.

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Also, Moe, is it legal/advisable to draw the putter back 6" on shorties, stop it there, and then just "slide" the putterhead over the hole to knock the ball in?

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Isn't that the Ichiro/Oh pause....to sustain energy as you go greet the ball?  That pasue isn't a loss of energy, just a smooth gaining of it, I think.

I think we're saying the same thing here.

Seems to me, anyway.  In golf you lose energy by casting, early, from the top.  Do that in baseball and you're out in front and holding on tight.  Unless you're lucky enough to be Kirk Gibson, that usually results in a K and a sulking back to the dugout.

As Jeff will tell you, putting is a different game, a bit like bunting, perhaps.  But generally the idea in putting is to get that same smooth transition. I can think of no great putter who "stopped" the putter head.  Guys who can't get it started or can't get it going the other way are guys who have the Y-word.

Shuuuuuu!! Quiet!!!!!  Don't let the golf gods hear you say that word.  'Tis a terrible affliction.

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RockiesJeff's picture

Keith Moe Norman, I wrote you back but low/no-tech that I am, probably hit the wrong buttons. Anyway, indeed we agree. The key is that you say it so much better than me! I love this statement - "That pause isn't a loss of energy, just a smooth gaining of it, I think." Power is never built up by a jerky movement.

Of course, with the putting....LOL! Don't mention the Y-word! Do you remember Johnny Miller in his prime used the blade with a kind of the short stroke and almost a tiny little mini-pause. Talk about copying Jack's head tilt.....for a couple of years I loved to watch that and probably did a terrible job of imitation. But then that mini-pause became a mini-jerk as the Y-bug made itself at home. Scary! Is there an innoculation?

Do you remember Julius Boros? Swing easy - hit hard!

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